Fahrenheit 9/11 / Michael Moore

[kristycarberry]

Hi everyone!
I know that you aren't supposed to talk politics or religion, but...the big topic around here lately has been the movie Farenheit 9/11. This is probably as much of a controversial issue on this forum as it is everywhere else, but I really would like to hear opinions from those of you that have seen the film. We are going to see it tonight, so I will let you know what I think after I see it! I think that my parents, die hard republican George Bush supporters might disown me if they find out that hubby and I are going to see this film!
Joe and I used to be <n>really </b>strong supporters of Bush because of (ironically) how he showed such support for the military. We like the pay raises! However, so many things have happened to make me question my support. I really feel that the media can be quite one sided at times and I think my main reason for wanting to see this film is because I would like to see another side of the story. That and of course, the advertisement "Now watch this drive" bothered me like nothing has in quite a long time!

So, what is your take? What did you think of the film? If you have decided that you won't see it, is it because of time contraints or because you are against the film? I'd like to hear everyone's opinion!

As an addendum...I very reluctantly (I hated the guy) watched Michael Moore's "Bowling for Columbine" a while back and he mentioned that Canada provides free health care to everyone. If the US were to implement this, as Moore seems to advocate, how do you think it would affect the nursing profession?

Love him or hate him, he really gives a lot of food for thought!

Kristy

[1mg.epi]

Michael Moore and health care. Excuse me as I vomit.

My dear sister lives in New Zealand which has socialized med.
Few months ago she had a stroke. Well the dr would not put her on plavix which was indicated for her CVA. The reason was it cost to much. They would not wright the Rx even if she was going to pay out of pocket.

The food they fed her in the hospital was poor quality. Yet, the lady down the hall got good low fat meals, why? The lady down the hall had supplemental insurance.

My sister needed a carotid ultrasound. She had to wait 2 months before getting it. She had to wait her "tern". OK, our standard is 2-3 days if not sooner. She said she would have to wait 6 months to a year for a carendarectomy if she needed one.

I had recovered a lady who was from Engalnd. She had am MI and had a CABG. I recovered her. She told me that she was so happy that she had her MI in the states. She would had to wait her tern to get her CABG.

You know our health care is expensive. Our insurance is expensive. BUT most of the time you get PROPER TREATMENT when it is needed.

Now think how expensive socialized health care would be. Our taxes whoud sky rocket. The increase in your taxes would be quite abit more than you pay for insurance.
In New Zealand Nurses make less than $30,000 a year. At the exchange rate that is less than $18,000 a year. Found on new zealand nursing web site. Now think, you do not work for a company, you work for the government.

I would like to know what the tax rate is in Canada is due to socialezed med. I hear it is great for getting glasses and meds. What if you need cancer tx, or a CABG and what is the quality of care. That I could not say.

And with Michael Moore sure he brings up a lot of questions but he never has answers.

If you complain, and you do not have a viable solution to the problem, you are part of the problem.

Mr. Michael Moore has the right to his say. Of course in the middle east they would have cut off hes head for how he speaks out. It would be nice if he was more constructive and not so disrespectfull.

[cassioo]

I hear in Canada it's the same as you mentioned other places you wait for services. My brother lives in Michigan and he's bitching that his $90 med can be had for $10 in Canada so I told him then go to Canada it'd be worth the drive ....or here's a concept get a job with some insurance and pay less then $90....and he is capable he has a Master's degeree (ok he is on workman's comp right now for falling off a ladder at work and twisting his knee and he's been waiting in MI for almost a year to fix that but first couldn't get cardiac clearance then had to have get that fixed then was in pre-op for the knee and had himself so worked up they couldn't get his b/p down) He's in theater too so he has NO clue how the medical system really does work and was upset about having to get pre-op labs, cardiac clearance etc...he's making me nuts blames the nurse worknig for the insurance company, blanes the insurance, blames workman's comp, blames the theater.

[1mg.epi]

Ya when family asks me a medical questions or how the system works I tell them to ask their dr. Boy they get mad.

Michael Moore still makes me vomit

[kristycarberry]

Thanks 1mg and Cassioo for your replies. We just came in from watching the film. 1mg, I guess we are all entitled to our opinions, and I certainly respect yours. I thought pretty much the same thing about Moore not that long ago. But I have come to realize that he isn't unpatriotic like some of the media portray. He's just a man that wants answers to some questions, and he has every right to ask them...just as everyone has the ability to disagree with him. I, however, don't disagree. I really don't want to discuss this film tonight, because after watching it, I felt like I had ran a 3 day marathon. It wasn't a bunch of opinions interlaced with facts like "Bowling for Columbine". It was fact after fact, after fact. I really encourage all of you to see it, if for no other reason so that you can make your own decisions about it. I always like to have both sides of the story.

Thanks for your input on the healthcare system in Canada!

[Anonymous]

I haven't seen the movie.. But I will say this. My son is a Marine..8 years. And I am a pacifist. And the one thing I am proud of him is the fact that he says he will fight for my right to be a pacifist. Now that's what our young men and woman should be fighting for.. Our rights to be, think, and say what we want..

JMHO

WR,,, three commas for Becca


JOHN EDWARDS....Yippppeeeeeeeeeee.

[cassioo]

And I am a pacifist. And the one thing I am proud of him is the fact that he says he will fight for my right to be a pacifist. Now that's what our young men and woman should be fighting for.. Our rights to be, think, and say what we want..


sounds like my husband. Retired after 20 years USAF. Says he might not agree with you but will defend your right to think what you do.

[Anonymous]

Now that's a true hero.. And I would "defend" his right to feel, think, and do what he thinks is right. I wouldn't kill someone for him but I have my ways.. ))


WR,,, three commas for Becca

[kristycarberry]

Wandering and Cassioo, I think that is just about what any person that has ever served will say, as they should. A lot of people don't like my opinions. Maybe that is why I served in the military...I have always been an opinionated person, just ask my parents! They probably had enough of me about 20 years ago and I'm only in my mid twenties. My husband is one of the most opinionated people that I have ever met. He asks more questions than anyone I know and always has something to say about the answer! He will be glad to tell you that he has earned that right and he has made sure that others have it as well.

I guess I will talk about the film now, since I started the topic. Last night, I was just too exhausted. I was really shocked by the amount of facts and lack of commentary by Moore in the film. If you've seen some of his other work, you know he often likes to put in his thoughts. This one really just showed the facts. I talked with my Mother about the movie tonight and she refuses to see it because she is convinved that it is one sided. And it may be, but I find that hard to believe when the facts can be backed up. I find it very disturbing that the Saudi's have personally given the Bush family 1.4 Billion dollars over the past 30 years. It really bothers me that we did not question the 142 members of the Ben Ladin family that were in the US during the attacks and that we had them flown to Saudi on 9/13 without any questions. This just bothers me. A lot of the things bothered me. Now, don't label me a bleeding heart liberal that just wants Bush gone. That is NOT the case at all. I want honest answers. I want straight answers. Honestly, I feel like this is the first thing that I have seen to come close to giving me those answers. I realize that there are some things that we as citizens don't need to know and therefore, the government can't give us any answers on some things, but the things that were shown on this film were extremely disturbing and I think that we deserve a better reply than "It's all liberal propoganda" But that's just me. I'd like to hear from other's than have seen the film that DID NOT like it and DISAGREE with it. It's always nice to hear more opinions, so if anyone has seen it, please pitch in!
Kristy

[cassioo]

I wouldn't mind seeing it but I think I'd take it like the news you see what they want to show you.
Honesty and politics...I think the closest that has ever been is Jimmy Carter and being too nice didn't work well for him either.