Hi!
I hope this topic isn't too out of line for this forum. It tends to be an emotional one - at least when pregnant women discuss it. I am an Pediatric/Postpartum Nurse and have assisted with Circumcisions and cared for infants and boys both circumcised and uncircumcised. I just assisted in the first circ in a long time and to tell you the truth I was pretty appalled - again. I have not witnessed one circumcision that wasn't extremely traumatizing to the infant or done for an actual medical problem. Claims are being made that adult circumcision is much more difficult and traumatic. I don't know what specialties you are all in, but I think it would be good to hear from men in the nursing profession whether they think routine infant circumcision is necessary from a medical and personal standpoint. I know this topic has the potential to go into "unprofessional" directions, but I'm hoping for some honest, informed opinions regarding the matter. There's a lot of information on the internet and in books, but I'm finding that when parents are making the decision to circumcise their boys, they are almost completely clueless and are basing their decision on a lot of misinformation or lack of information.
Thanks for any thoughts you can share.
I think that it is beneficial in terms of decreasing the chances of infection, although it could ironically occur due to circumsicion at the time it is performed. The societal aspect is obviously a strong one in terms of appearance I'm guessing.
That's my opinion, off the top of my head and based on very little if any fact
I had mine done much later in life and honestly it caused a lot of headaches and frustration in my teenage years.
Would have preferred that my parents had it done at birth and to have been done with it.
It can be said that the way most doctors do it (without anesthesia, site preparation) is a bit barbaric, but the kids typically are no worse for the wear by the next day.
Andrew Lopez, RN
http://www.4nursing.comYou think a circumcised penis looks good??? YUCK. The 4 most important men in my life were uncircumcised. My preference. 3 of them had more infections in their ears than their penis... Matter of fact none of them had any infections of their penis...
WR,,, three commas for Becca
I really don't think appearance has much to do with the issue. I am married to a circumcised man so this is what I'm used to. My son is uncircumcised and hopefully he will marry someone who hasn't become too "familiar" or "comfortable" with the look of a circumcised penis, or any for that matter. I really think it depends on what your are used to, and you can get used to anything when your really love your husband.
Jane
Being the weekend option outpatient nurse, I have seen urgent circumcisions done on the weekends. Mainly due to strictures. I have seen many un-circumcised men have problems and a few of the urologists recommend having it done.
When I worked as a School Nurse at a school with a large handicapped population (100 students in 400) mostly severely handicapped, I became pregnant. I found myself worrying a lot more than the avg about my child being born handicapped. I realized that my perception of the problem was skewed because I worked in an environment specifically made for those with handicaps. I wonder if, when we nurses work in hospitals and clinics where people with medical problems are drawn for treatment, we forget to look at the big picture and put the problems in their proper perspective.
Do you think that if you looked at the whole population of the country the number of men with the problems you mentioned would warrent every infant being circumcised to prevent them having a problem later?
Or do you find yourself expecting problems to crop up because you have seen so many of the small percentage that have problems?
I see your point. I see a lot of gull bladder problems. that does not mean every body has gull bladder problems. Only a small percentage have problems. Same as un-circumcised men, see a small sampling of people with problems.
I think we are often teaching the public based on our own personal perceptions. (This is actually a new thought for me- I guess I'm thinking out loud.)
I almost panicked a few times when I decided not to circumcise my son because of the horror stories I heard. But I was helped along because he was a premie and it would have been difficult to put him through one more traumatizing procedure and to try figure out when the best time to do it would have been (I think there is a certain window when it is less painful and healing is quicker).
I'm glad I didn't have it done and he can make the decision for himself but I keep hearing it it worse for a older person. I don't what grounds people are basing that on since you can't really ask an infant about their experience and most I've seen were done without anesthectic.
There is a sign in our nursery at the hospital that says "Document Pain in Circumcised Infants". I'm beginning to think they must be doing some sort of research because they are not ensuring that all the newborns are medicated and from what I've seen in the babies reactions it looks as bad or worse than childbirth (only they are strapped down for it). I would think even if a grown person would remember this, it must still have some effect.
I have seen research that found that circumcised boys had a lower pain threshold then uncircumcised.
OK now I may be rambling.
If you look closely I was responding to shortbus and his comment that circumsiced penis' looked good.
WR,,, three commas for Becca
at my hospital the use EMLA cream before. There are studies about pain in infants. There used to be many procedures on infants without meds because of their "immature" nervous system but times are changing. Had all my boys done they seem no worse for the wear now.
Cass neither are mine.. And they aren't "done"...
WR,,, three commas for Becca
And EMLA cream goes in and out of favor all the time..What happens when it's out of favor..For awhile it was off the market. Our dialysis patients couldn't get it.
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jonasmom said:
I'm glad I didn't have it done and he can make the decision for himself but I keep hearing it it worse for a older person. I don't what grounds people are basing that on since you can't really ask an infant about their experience and most I've seen were done without anesthectic.
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I'm glad my mother did not think like you. Of course it is worse for an adult male than a newborn in regard to circumcision pain. I was circumcised as a newborn but certainly don't remember the event.
As an OR RN doing foley catheters on male patients it is very obvious the infection rates as well as the chance of strictures is much higher in uncircumcised males.
My wife & I visited a friend yesterday that had just given birth the day before. I don't recall how the subject got started but she shared the fact she was undecided on whether or not to have her baby circumcised. She is in disfavor of such, however her husband is for the procedure. I certainly did not express my opinion to her based out of respect. Although, I wonder if it had anything to do with her being French? BTW, her husband is an American.
By no means do I put puppies on the same level as newborns, however I raised Dobermans many years ago & never had a problem with getting their ears cropped. Yet, I'd never consider getting an adult Doberman's ears cropped. Maybe a bad comparison. Just a thought to throw out.
I am glad I had it done when I was born. OUCH, to think of having it done now! OK I am a bit of a wooss.
I think it is better for men to have the circumcision done when they are young. It will keep them cleaner when they are adults.
I am a male nursing student who will graduate this December. Having witnessed two infant circumcisions on my recently completed Maternity-OB clinical rotation (one using the PlastiBell and the other using a Gomco), I must say I was rather appalled by the entire process. I asked one of the Docs if this was truly a medical necessity. Her reply was that the American Association of Pediatricians stated it was not "absolute". I went to the AAP's website and found this statement adopted in 1999.
"Existing scientific evidence demonstrates potential medical benefits of newborn male circumcision; however, these data are not sufficient to recommend routine neonatal circumcision. In circumstances in which there are potential benefits and risks, yet the procedure is not essential to the child's current well-being, parents should determine what is in the best interest of the child. To make an informed choice, parents of all male infants should be given accurate and unbiased information and be provided the opportunity to discuss this decision. If a decision for circumcision is made, procedural analgesia should be provided."
PEDIATRICS Vol. 103 No. 3 March 1999, pp. 686-693
http://aappolicy.aappublications.org/cgi/content/full/pediatrics%3b103/3/686
Although the AAP's position promotes the use of procedural analgesia, the only comfort measures used in the two circumisions I witnessed was the use of sugar water to quell the screaming.
Circ. is an alteration in the body that the person it is done to has no choice. Hygiene is the proper way to address preventing infection. I resent never having a choice in this matter. Most of what I have read indicates that this is done out of custom/ritual/religion and that sensation is diminished by this practice.
Sorry people but it hurts those little guys. I took care of 2 babies freshly circumcised and every time some thing touched them they started crying and vomiting. There have been studies done that proved that infants do in fact feel pain even at birth. back in the late nineties the nurses at St. Vincent Hospital in Santa Fe, New Mexico went on strike protesting circumcision without first being medicated. As far as I know they now use at least a local anesthetic. I hope all hospitals follow suite. Just my 2 cents.
Here's a problem that no one told me about in nursing school... I let my husband decide whether or not to circumcise our son, and he decided it was a good idea. Like father like son. About the time of his 6 month dr's visit, I noticed something didnt look quite right with the head of his penis. I brought it to the pediatricians attention... she made a quick move and my son started screaming. His circumcision had readhered. So basically, she did it again. I've heard from co-workers that this is not a rare occurance... ouch!
