im new to the site and in need of some advice and reassurance. My story goes a little something like this... I obtained my lvn license in 01 and went through a dental procedure and became addicted to pain killers. I was working for a docters office and was caught calling in prescriptions to pharmacies. I also was written up for coming to work groggy from taking too many prozac. Then i walked out on them one day when they were understaffed, after being refused any help. They reported me to the tx bon, i surrendered my license and the board told me that i could petition after one year, and 12 months verifiable sobriety. This was in 06, i had given up fell into a deep depression, and called it quits. My kids and husband helped me to regain my confidence and i just started taking monthly drug test in january of this year, i also completed an outpatient 21 day treatment program with a facility called brentwood. Now that my 12 months of testing is coming to an end i decided to start researching others experiences, and i must say im really discouraged now. I read that the board will probably say my test arent sufficient, enforce polygraphs and pyc evals and lawyers and all types of things. I would like to hear from someone with some knowledge of this type of situation. Can anyone help me and let me know what to expect, or what else i can do to better my chances of regaining my license?
Just wondering where did I go wrong with reaching out for help through this site. It's been a while and still nobody has responded. Can someone offer some suggestions on how to get any advice on my situation?
I am sorry that you have not received any replies... but applaud you for not giving up and for repeating your request for some help on your situation.
I am not from TX, but have read quite a bit about the way they work and follow a few blogs from TX lawyers involved with the BON.
I concur with your conclusion and strongly suggest seeking legal help with this in order to get the best outcome. I personally know a nurse who had good success after hiring a lawyer, and can give you his name privately.
Hi, I am new to site and just got through reading your thread. I'm also in texas. How is your situation going ? I'm in Tpapn, so on a little different path. Let me know. Get a lawyer for sure, one that is educated on the BON, that makes a big difference.
Im sooo glad I finally got someone to respond I had lost hope. Well I'm currently attending NA meetings 3 times weekly. I talked with my moniter in Oct and she said the random drug screens and the 21 day outpatient treatment wasn't enough and that I should go to the meetings. I wish I could afford a lawyer!! I've been praying that when I submit what I have and petition in March that something will happen. I hope they will allow me to participate in TPAPN. Im just so ready to go back to work. Welcome to the site and thanks for writing it really means a lot. Whome 3 I would like to know of that lawyer it doesnt hurt to at least contact them, you never know what the future may bring.
hi, really glad to hear from u. I tried to send a reply about some steps I have taken they may help with the BON and recovery (#1). I guesss it didn't send. (I was on a break @ work on my phone, screne is kinda small !) Let me know if interested, ok ?
tweetybird rn wrote:hi, really glad to hear from u. I tried to send a reply about some steps I have taken they may help with the BON and recovery (#1). I guesss it didn't send. (I was on a break @ work on my phone, screne is kinda small !) Let me know if interested, ok ?
YES!! I'm extremely interested. I've never gotten any responses from anyone on here so I'm still learning the ropes on replies and everything. I did answer the friends request. After responses went second to none I stopped coming on as much. Please do let me know those steps.
So sorry you have not been receiving a lot of responses. I don't know anything about the Texas Bon - But it sounds like you are on the right track. Do go to the meetings they are helpful to keep your stress at bay especially when you start working again.
It has been suggested that you seek the advice of an attorney - My own experience with using an attorney to deal with the BON was not very successful - The attorney told me that since I had no criminal charges and the program was "voluntary" I had little choice but to comply with the BON program.
I sat down and figured it all out the other day. I was in the California Program for just under Five years. Rehab cost me $15,000, Monthly program fee from the BON for 51 momnths $1300.00, Lab tests 2 monthly for 51 months $6800.00, I paid an attorney a $2500 retainer (which did me no good at all).
Grand total $25,600 to keep my license - (We actually took out a second mortgage on our house which we paid off as soon as I started working again).
The results however were priceless as I honestly believe that I would be dead today if I had kept going in the direction I was going.
My experience and advice is whenever possible don't fight with the BON. It's very rare that you'll win and I don't know of any BON program that does not require documented AA or NA attendance.
Remember that resentment and anger are the root causes of our disease
When we give into resentment, anger, and indignation (even the justifiable kind) we stay sick. We are only as sick as our anger and resentment allow us to be.
That was so awesome to read!! Well when I surrendered I received paperwork saying I had to wait 12 months and then provide 12 months verifiable sobriety before I could petition. I've gotten a 21 day out treatment program down and 12 months of random urine drug tests completed but being too "embarassed" didnt start NA until October after I called the board and they told me just the randoms wasnt enough. MY moniter told me to get at least 3-4 months with NA and then try to petition. So thats what I'm doing. I pray so much that if they dont grant them with some kind of stip that they will at least let me in their TPAPN program. At least I will feel like I'm making some kind of progress. I've gone without my license since 06 and I'm so ready to get this behind me and start back doing what I know I'm supposed to be doing and not taking advantage of what my God has provided for me. This has been the most humbling experience of my LIFE!! and I've had a life which is a major part of why I self medicated. Through this I've actually learned my problem and am able to recognize the differences in me and when I need to be seen about, instead of pushing on and finding other ways to mask the problems. I pray something happens this year, but if not I know my higher power will find a way, I just pray this is the path he has chosen for me.
Hi- so glad to hear from u ! Sounds like ur really trying and making good progess. OK, I will lay out what I have learned and hope it wull help u. If I were in ur shoes @ this point I would recommened looking up tpapn web site and follow those guidelines as close as possible. Thet really do have a great program for recovery, it works. The Texas BON does work with tpap. They aknowledge the program as a strong one and those who complete it are given credit. Some of the guidelines r 90 / 90 meetings (90 meetings in nineth days, then it is 4 meetings a week for the remainder of the two years. I know it is a lot but it works, you get so use to it after a while. It helps to retrain ur thinking into sobriety, it takes two years (they say) to get some of the old triggers out of our heads. I love the meetings and the people I have met, many nurses, doctors, RT'S believe me we r not alone. Also they require counseling w/ an addiction specialist @ least 1 x per week and group 1 x per week until the counselor releases u. They will write a plan for u. Keep copies of all ur records, a journal or notebook of every appt u have. Any progress notes the MD, counselor writes. Don't write all ur problems in there, the BON only wants to know about ur your recovery progress. They are overwhelmed as is. Make sure u have / get sponsor in NA / AA keep dates of meeting and what step u are working each month, and what it mrans to u. It's easier to write it down as u go than to try and remember everything, really it is. Make sure u have a PMD, even if u don't think u need need one. Your MD needs to know about ur subtance abuse hx. Talk to him / her honestly, they will be more understanding than u would ever think. Most people really want to help someone that is trying. Get any Rx filled @ only one pharmacy so a record can b pulled if asked. Try not to take any mind altering meds, even benadryl, those r off limits in tpapn, and get tested for. Ther have been times all of this pissed me off etc, but if I am really honest w/ myself I know that a year ago I could have cared less if I lived or died. In fact death seemed easier. Tpapn, recovery, AA all of it are life, and a good life. I'm not perfect by no means, but I'm gratful. Pt's Im taking care of have the right to a nurse who not impaired on anything, not even hung over. I would expect that as pt, we all would. I never practiced thinking I was altered, or too sick to work. But this disease eats us up. Thank God there is help. I'm probably leaving some out, sorry. I will re-read and add whatever I can to help !! Packing for a trip, have an early flight. Will check back in ASAP. Bye for now. - Tweetybird-
tweetybird rn wrote:Hi- so glad to hear from u ! Sounds like ur really trying and making good progess. OK, I will lay out what I have learned and hope it wull help u. If I were in ur shoes @ this point I would recommened looking up tpapn web site and follow those guidelines as close as possible. Thet really do have a great program for recovery, it works. The Texas BON does work with tpap. They aknowledge the program as a strong one and those who complete it are given credit. Some of the guidelines r 90 / 90 meetings (90 meetings in nineth days, then it is 4 meetings a week for the remainder of the two years. I know it is a lot but it works, you get so use to it after a while. It helps to retrain ur thinking into sobriety, it takes two years (they say) to get some of the old triggers out of our heads. I love the meetings and the people I have met, many nurses, doctors, RT'S believe me we r not alone. Also they require counseling w/ an addiction specialist @ least 1 x per week and group 1 x per week until the counselor releases u. They will write a plan for u. Keep copies of all ur records, a journal or notebook of every appt u have. Any progress notes the MD, counselor writes. Don't write all ur problems in there, the BON only wants to know about ur your recovery progress. They are overwhelmed as is. Make sure u have / get sponsor in NA / AA keep dates of meeting and what step u are working each month, and what it mrans to u. It's easier to write it down as u go than to try and remember everything, really it is. Make sure u have a PMD, even if u don't think u need need one. Your MD needs to know about ur subtance abuse hx. Talk to him / her honestly, they will be more understanding than u would ever think. Most people really want to help someone that is trying. Get any Rx filled @ only one pharmacy so a record can b pulled if asked. Try not to take any mind altering meds, even benadryl, those r off limits in tpapn, and get tested for. Ther have been times all of this pissed me off etc, but if I am really honest w/ myself I know that a year ago I could have cared less if I lived or died. In fact death seemed easier. Tpapn, recovery, AA all of it are life, and a good life. I'm not perfect by no means, but I'm gratful. Pt's Im taking care of have the right to a nurse who not impaired on anything, not even hung over. I would expect that as pt, we all would. I never practiced thinking I was altered, or too sick to work. But this disease eats us up. Thank God there is help. I'm probably leaving some out, sorry. I will re-read and add whatever I can to help !! Packing for a trip, have an early flight. Will check back in ASAP. Bye for now. - Tweetybird-
Wow!! Tweety sounds like a big order, but I'll try. I worry because the way the economy has gone it has done a doozie on the benefits my husband's job provided. We use to have great insurance especially for mental and substance abuse counseling, but now it has changed dramatically!! I had to stop going to my doctor(due to overblown deductible) and counseling is strictly an out of pocket expense.It's sad cause as soon as I started my recovery the policy changed, as long as it wasn't being used the benefits were great. I can't receive any kind of assistance because he brings in way more than their guidelines allow, you know in Tx you have to be indigent before they will assist you with anything. Unless you find loop holes and I ain't trying to go thru all that!!
I wished when you try and talk to people from the BON they were a little more willing to let you know what you need to do. The lady I talked to was so mean, but I guess I have to try to put myself in her shoes having to deal with people like me, but I still don't think I would be so cold. I don't know.. my financial situation may be my downfall at this point, not having the resources to do all these things will hurt in the long run.
You know, I completed an Office Professional course in 08, but have been unsuccessful in finding work, (fraud comes up on my background check along with being in that HIPDB and on that exclusion list, its tough) with two kids 16 an 12 it been tough for my husband, but he keeps on trucking I'm truly blessed to have had someone there for me thru my recovery and healing process.
I don't know we have very good AD&D and Life insurance through his work and I have selfish thoughts, sometimes I feel like I'm better for them gone, I can contribute so much more that way. I wouldn't act on it, I believe in Heaven and Hell, but I tell you I constantly ask my higher power if he is sure he is not done with me LOL... I really get down about it, that useless and worthless feeling comes and goes. I'm not giving up a little give out, but just reading what you guys post really gives me a boost!! (Sorry got started and had to catch myself)
Hope you have fun and be safe on your trip!!
freezing round these parts
here is a link to a TX lawyer who has extensive knowledge about the TX BON. I know several nurses who had better outcomes using him.
In normal curcumstances, ie impaired, and reported, the need for legal representation is not usually of use, but in cases that are complex, or that don't have any established guidelines I strongly suggest using legal counsel.
TX BON is one of the states that does not issue licenses easily or loosely, and can require more demands and stipulations that are outside their written regulations and laws.
I believe that Louis offers free consultations, and accepts payment plans. At least, he can give an idea of what you should expect, and what you need to have.
whome3 wrote:here is a link to a TX lawyer who has extensive knowledge about the TX BON. I know several nurses who had better outcomes using him.
In normal curcumstances, ie impaired, and reported, the need for legal representation is not usually of use, but in cases that are complex, or that don't have any established guidelines I strongly suggest using legal counsel.
TX BON is one of the states that does not issue licenses easily or loosely, and can require more demands and stipulations that are outside their written regulations and laws.
I believe that Louis offers free consultations, and accepts payment plans. At least, he can give an idea of what you should expect, and what you need to have.
Hi Nikalea,
How r u doing? Sorry took so long to respond just got back home. I really know how u felt when u metioned the life insurance thing, because I was so depressed @ one time too. But those feelings can and will be lifted if u r in a good recovery program, also I know money is tight but consider going to a doctor and talking about the depression, together u may decide u need medication for that. Its worth a shot, those feelings of shame are the very worst. Remember we are allowed to forgive ourselves too. Shame is a killer.I know it sounds like a lot, in beginning it really is. But it gets easier because as u make progress in your recovery they don't require as may sessions with counselor etc., or as many meetings. I don't have to do nearly what I did in the beginning. I will say that I easily put that kind of time, effort, and money into drinking. This replaces that with something healthy, a new habit if u will. A habit of healthy living, that is not what I was doing before that is for sure. Believe me I still get stressed out, like now. On my vacation I had 3 known accidental exposures, #1 getting a full manicure and nails done (etoh in the products didn't even think about that until I was soaking in it and glanced @ the bottle on the table), #2 Eating a peice of rum cake.#3 eating beer batter french fries. I did not know about the food until my daughter said, "that rum cake was so good that his wife made." I felt my stomach just drop. Then we went out to eat, I looked @ the menu closely (so I thought) burger w/ fries, somebody @ the table said, "They have the best beer battered fries here." I made an excuse to look @ the menu again, sure @ the top of the listings for "Burgers" it said our famous beer battered fries. I had only looked where it said next to the kinda of burger I ordered, it said simply served with fries. It is really a challenge when your away from home and have to be a detective. I had to take a UDS as soon I got back in town, now I'm just waiting. That does seem unfair, but @ the same time I know that the drug/etoh screening is important to complete the program. I have worked really hard to get where I'm at. My heart and soul are in this. I just want to stay close to home now until I complete this program. I know what I put in my food @ home and familar with the resturants I go to. It's worth the peice of mind. It would be so heartbreaking to have a postive result for something I didn't intentionally do. Guess I will find out soon enough. Just really glad to be home now and to resume my routine. Speaking of I have to go to a meeting now, then lunch with my sponsor. She is great ! Keep me posted, always good to hear from you. Bye for now -Tweetybird-
Hi I am a newbie here and am wondering what the chances are for getting my surrendered RN licensed from Arkansas endorsed so that I can enter into the Indiana state impaired nursing program. I surrendered my license in AR back in 6/08 and was told that after a year I can reapply for reinstatement.
I thought I had heard somewhere that one can not move a restricted license from one state to another. Could someone else provide some personal info on this? You could always contact the Board and ask them directly. In the long run, that is your best bet for getting accurate information.
dufusbug wrote:Hi I am a newbie here and am wondering what the chances are for getting my surrendered RN licensed from Arkansas endorsed so that I can enter into the Indiana state impaired nursing program. I surrendered my license in AR back in 6/08 and was told that after a year I can reapply for reinstatement.
Any info will be much appreciated
Sincerely,
Bill B.
Bill,
All states have their individual policies for licensure by endorsement, but the one commonality in all states is holding an active license in your home state.
Some states accept disciplinay monitoring in other states, others deny licensure until the license is clear and the monitoring complete. Some states don't allow the nurse to move while being monitored and there have been many nurses who were monitored by both states.
I am unsure how IN looks at this, but I do know that you must be reinstated in AR before doing anything else. If you have drug or alcohol issues, showing that you are no longer using is another standard requirement in all states, the specifis as to showing how differs however. There will also be some type of monitoring and other requirements in order to be reinstated.
Tread carefully with the ri bon. Do not go near them without an attorney
The director is not a very nice person. The director actually told a potential employer over the phone not to hire me. The woman wouldn't know me if she fell on me. My councelor of five years stopped treating me because she was concerned about her own license after a conversation she had with director of the board. She also told me that the director has it out for me.I made the mistake of making them look stupid, not intentionately. I got the distinct impression that most nurses are intimidated by them so there not used to having someone fight back. When i'm guilty I accept the consequenses of my actions, but if i'm innocent,look out. Anyway, watch your back
Hi! I have just completed year 2 of a 3-year program of monitoring by the Board. Whome3 is right-on when she recommends getting an attorney. I was ready to surrender my license after failing TPAPN twice--first for relapsing, then for missing 2 random drug tests. I thank God that at the last minute I found out about Louis Lechter and contacted his office; 2 days later he accompanied me to my informal hearing before the Board. They accepted my proof of 12 months of sobriety, so my license wasn't suspended. Now, more than 4 years later, I'm happy and successful in a job I love. Many times I felt like giving up, feeling ashamed and powerless. The process is punitive and harsh, with seemingly no compassion or understanding that addiction is an illness, not a crime or a deliberate evil. But the situation is what it is, and if one wants to stay licensed, the best choice is to get a good lawyer, make the best deal possible, and then accept the outcome. It's not easy to meet all the requirements, but it's been worth it. I really think that if I had given up on nursing I would always have felt like a failure. It war REALLY hard to go on interviews and face repeated rejection; I was amazed at how quickly I'd be shown the door once I'd disclosed my restrictions. Persistence and faith paid off, though, as they always do, and I found a job I really enjoy and am great at. I've earned back my confidence, and hope to have opportunities to help others as I've been helped. I'm sure this is way more than anyone wants to know, but it just kind of snowballed :-)
So, anyway, hang in there, hold your head high, get a good attorney, and do what you have to to keep your license. Best of luck to you!
PS: thank-you, Louis. Your support and guidance will not be forgotten!
Thanks for posting. I've got a question, when I talk to my monitor she is so vague on 12 months verifiable sobriety, she says 12 months drug screens and NA meetings. Is that what you had to do? Was there anything else? Is that what you had to submit before being able to enter TPAPN? See, I surrendered my license and I'm working to try and get them reinstated. I started drug screens Jan of '09 but didn't do NA, so I started NA in Oct of '09, I called in Jan of this year to check in and give a report to my monitor to be told that because alcohol wasn't included in my drug screens they weren't gonna accept them. I have started over, and now alcohol is included in my drug screens, which I had to anyway because I started NA so late in the year of '09, so it was ok. I spoke with a lawyer with Louis and he told me since I surrendered there was really nothing they could do, at this point just do what is required, there was nothing to fight because of the surrender. I know that each case is on an individual basis, but I just worry about the 12 month verifiable sobriety and if I'm on the right track or if she will come up with something else when I petition in Jan '11. Your right the feelings of failure rule my life no matter what text I read or what my shrink says and its hard for me to accept that I had an illness when it came to drugs. I chose to take them, and I haven't touched narcs since I received that letter, the party came to an end. I haven't even wanted to take any even when my shrink tries to give them to me for anxiety. I tell my sponsor that this is like that one spanking you got when you were a kid and it was the one that you will never forget, and it makes you think everyday!! I was 26 when I started doing my misdeeds and I'm 33 now, I'm grown and not selfish, and my priorities are in order. I want to show my children and husband so much more. I pray and hope that I will be able to nurse again, but if not I know that God will provide a way for my family and me. I won't give up until the fat lady sings :)
Thanks again for posting, and good luck on your journey.
Nikalea
I hadn't been doing the random drug tests from the time I was dropped from TPAPN until my hearing, as I didn't know I was supposed to, and had pretty much decided to just surrender my license. I had been going to meetings, but didn't have a written record. I guess I just presented myself well at the hearing, and had a good recommendation from my LCDC, in addition to the support of Louis. I really don't have any suggestions other than what you're already doing.
As for the feeling of failure, in my case anyway, it got much better with time. In addition to 12-step meetings, I did a lot of work on myself, listening to and reading books on shame, self esteem, and especially on boundaries and limit-setting. I found "Overcoming Anxiety and Depression," a set of CDs and DVDs, to be especially helpful; also "How to Speak Up, Set Limits and Say No" by Maria Arapakis (audio book from CareerTrack). I take an antidepressant which works very well, but no longer use or need meds for anxiety. I'm not a fan of benzos. Turns out that all the years I'd been on them they just masked the problem, and it wasn't until I learned to face my fears and deal with them that I got true relief. Ironically, I seldom feel anxious anymore, now that I don't take anxiolytics. I'm a psych nurse, and I see so many patients who become dependent on meds for relief, rather than learning effective coping skills. And the more benzos they take, the more they need. Don't get me wrong, I think they're appropriate for very SHORT-TERM use, in crisis, but I seldom see them used that way. Anyway, that's my 2 cents, for what its worth! :nurse-soapbox:
I hope you can find something helpful in this post, and hang in there--as Stuart Smalley said "You're good enough, you're smart enough, and gosh darn it, people like you!" (If you've never seen Stuart Saves His Family, you really should.)
